• 7 Jun 2020, 4:57 p.m.

    As some of you know, I am collecting pocketwatches, IWC only.

    Far from saying that my collection is a museum collection but I am proud to
    have found some nice and rare pieces over time.

    Some of the pocketwatches are common, easy to find on the market, sometimes in
    better condition than mine, but some I have are gems.

    So in these crazy times, as the museum in Schaffhausen is closed, why not open
    one here on the forum.

    As long as the museum is closed, I will post here daily a pocketwatch from my
    collection.

    I hope I don't run out of pieces before the virus is beaten. Fingers crossed
    for all of us.

    I will post them in a random order, with some comments, feel free to join.

    Keep safe all.

    DAY 78, cal 22, Seeland.

    From the common cal 52 yesterday, this one is a rare cal 22 from the Seeland
    era.

    It has the 3/4 plate and a nice decoration, even under the balance, what a
    difference with the fullplate Seelands I showed here before ( cal 24, cal 24
    and cal 25 ).

    The cal 22 was the inspiration for the later cal 28 bascule a pilier.

    The cal 22 from my collection comes in a nice 14K case, no brand on the dial,
    but a wonderful inscription in wave form on the movement.

    I have a cal 28 with a similar engravement.

    To date these Seeland cal 22 isn't easy, no much info around, but I guess 1878
    to 1880 could be right.

  • Master
    7 Jun 2020, 4:58 p.m.

    Some 19 days ago, or there abouts and on the 59th day of the closure of the
    Museum in Schaffhausen, Tonny posted Seeland pocketwatch, and I complimented
    his post by posting one of the Seeland from my collection too - and where I
    showed how one could compare the dates of each individual watch by looking up
    the hallmark year date stamp.

    [That post can be found here](/t/virtual-pocket-watch-

    museum-day-59-seeland-case-253/31887/post/280393/)

    So, rather than showing you another Seeland calibre I will pickup today on
    Tonnys post and in particular this hallmark stamp from his handsome pocket-
    watch as well as a snall continuation of yesterdays post where Adrian has
    pointed out that whilst Tonny's watch was a C.52 that as I thought, mine was
    an earlier C.49.

    The Watch

    Every now and again, as Collectors we come accross pocket watches, and think
    that we should add the particulate watch to our collection - even if we
    already have a pocket watch bearing that Calibre already. It could be, that
    the example you found is nicer than the one you already have, or in the case
    of some very rare Calibre timepieces, simply know that you cannot let the
    particular watch go , given it's rarity. And so it happens that you end up
    with multiple Seeland calibre watches or C.52's and in this case, dare I say
    C.49's?

    Now when I saw this watch in Budapest, it imeadiatley appealed to me. However,
    I had not quiet seen one like this before and asked the seller if the watch
    was genuine. His answer ; Guaranteed Genuine !

    And when I asked him how he could be so sure he sent this picture.

    How could I argue with that?

    The photo I sharer here is that of the seller and as you can see, the watch
    itself simply oozes the very best of what Schaffhausen had to offer in 1890.

    She sports her Schafhausen Bok (the Schaffhausen Ram which is the symbol of
    Schaffhusen) proudly as you see here below.

    The Schaffhusen Bok was used on the IWC movement up sporadically up until
    someone in IWC came up with the idea to migrate rather to their own Probus
    Scafusia
    stamp of quality, and as not to compete further with the towns
    emblem.

    Either way, the good folk of Schaffhausen are proud of their Bok, and it could
    and can be found on such diverse things as watches to swords.

    In fact if you happen to visit Schaffhuasen, and the Munot - the fort that
    guards Schaffhausen from up high...

    You will find the Schaffhausen Bok also displayed proudly on their cannons.

    But... I digress, carried away by the lore of Schaffhausen.

    The inner case back is also of 14K gold, and is engraved with serial number
    and International Watch Co.

    And the movement itself may just bring tears to our esteamed moderators eyes.

    (serial number removed to protect the innocent)

    But wait a minute....what gives here?

    Compare the movement here from this watch (below on the left) with the
    movement that I posted yesterday, and where Adrian had corrected my labelling
    it a Cal. 52 to show it was a Cal. 49 (below on the right).

    Want to play Spot the difference again?

    Red indicates a single main plate screw situated higher up on the left and
    closer to the smaller ratchet wheel - where on the C.49 on the right it is in
    the middle between the two ratchet wheels.

    Blue indicates a thicker edge to the main bridge plate around the balance
    wheel

    Green indicates the rachet spring lying in an indentation around a jewel
    setting above the actual ratchet - where, on the C.49 it sits around the
    rachet itself.

    So, if it's not a Calibre 49, and it's not a Cal.52 - what is it exactly then?
    Oh Dear how am I ever going to survice this without the input of the wise
    men!!!

  • Master
    7 Jun 2020, 5:09 p.m.

    Tonny, beautiful piece.

    Adrian,

    (alwaysiwc).

  • Master
    8 Jun 2020, 5:24 p.m.

    Mark, movement number please.

    Adrian,

    (alwaysiwc).

  • Master
    8 Jun 2020, 6:02 p.m.

    Without
    knowing the movement number, I can already say that the were 3 versions of cal
    49. Every 1-3 years small modifications were applied.

    Looking to the details of the 2 movements, I do not believe that the gap
    between the three quarter plate and the cock that holds the balance wheel
    differ significantly. But apart from that there are some differences between
    the two, which you don't mention. The big wheels ( crown wheel and rachet
    wheel) are fixed by one solitary screw in both movements, but the size and the
    cut out in which they are sunk, are quite different. Further the screwed
    chaton opposite to the cock that holds the rachet wheel are mounted on a
    different distance from the edge of the three quarter plate.

    Once again it shows that it is very hard or even impossible to distinguish the
    two movements if one does not see them side to side.Would it matter if it is
    cal. 49 first or second version? I really believe that this is only important
    for watch nuts like you and me. But for the rational straiht foreward
    collector it might be of importance to know : do I see a cal. 52/53 or is it a
    forerunner. And that can easily be concluded from the design of the three
    quarter plate only.

    Adrian,

    (alwaysiwc).

  • Master
    8 Jun 2020, 6:28 p.m.

    Adrian the serial number of the movement has been sent to you, by email.

  • Master
    8 Jun 2020, 6:32 p.m.

    Adrian, would it matter? I agree, probably ONLY to pocket watch "nutters".

    Does it matter? Yes of course, it matters.

    Know, I will not sleep untill I know exactly what version of a Cal.49 it is -
    if even to be able to challenge Tonny a little bit to expand his collection.
    to include ALL THREE RELEASES OF CALIBRE 49

  • Master
    8 Jun 2020, 7:53 p.m.

    OK Mark,

    From one nut to the other, this nut quotes from the article :

    '...Calibre 49 was built in three different versions, recognisable by the way
    the crown wheel and the rachet wheel were fixed. In the oldest version, the
    crown wheel and rachet wheel were fixed by two screws, each pressing a
    circular plate on top of each wheel, respectively ( fig. 9 in the article).
    The second version had one big screw to fix the crown wheel and one screw
    pressing a circular plate on the rachet wheel ( fig 10 in the article). The
    third version had no plates and only a large screw for both wheels ( Fig. 11
    in the article). In all three variations the ancre ( pallet fork) was held by
    a small asymmetric cock.'....

    Adrian,

    (alwaysiwc).